Discussion of "The Unknown" by shadinah

You have certainly created an air of mystery and have left open several strands of the story to follow. What you have to worry about is your English grammar. There are several mistakes. I can't point them out because your story is not before me as I write my comments. I remember one where you used the adjective myriad and should have gone straight to the noun. You also should tell us it's Friday in the opening of your story. It sticks out like a red clown's nose where it is. Also make it clear she's a woman from the start. I was confused with the opening dialogue. I thought the janitor was speaking to a man called Pete. Make it clear who is speaking. If you improve the English and clear up these trifling problems, this could easily warrant a 4.5 rating. You write vey well otherwise.

Thank you for those suggestions. I'm not to sure how to clarify the gender in the bit with the janitor - do you have any suggestions? I tried to show that the janitor was an old man speaking to "Ms. B", who in turn would have to be the main character. However, I do understand that since that idea was already in my head, that's the perspective I saw it from when I read it.

Hey, Whale, I would love your critique for mine...I am somewhat of a perfectionist, so would love to hear your opinion...

This one is my fav!!

Beautifully written - great introduction - the suspense is intense. I liked it a lot, wouldn't change a thing.

Heard you were the one with the best critiques...mind reading mine and telling me what you think (Amanda & Special).

Excellent - I love your imagery (the mist covering the town in a ghostly blanket, etc). We don't know much about our protagonist yet, but you've given us lots of great clues. I'm certainly curious to learn more. And the child's statement at the end - great! Well done!

Usually I am firmly against people critisizing grammar, and ironically it was hebe6405 that picked me up on it in my story, yet they don't mention it here. As far as I am concerned, mispellings etc. are fine; but as Whale points out, a couple of the mistakes here actually hinder the reading of the story, which is importent. However, I make these mistakes, and I'm not going to critisise them now; because a) someone's already mentioned it b) I'm sure you, like me, are aware of these mistakes.

It was well written, in terms of structure and style, and that's something I think you need to concentrate on, along with perhaps working on those mistakes (to gain top marks), if not, meh.

I'm going to sat 4/5, from because it was very good, but unfortunetly, I just thought a couple of the mistakes, in terms of fluency let it down a bit.

(I realise a couple of my points may be slightly contradictory. Two reasons, it's very early in the morning/late at night. Secondly - when a mistake ruins the fluency of the narration, it's a bad mistake, when it's a simple technical fault, e.g. grammar, format, it's forgivable). Sorry for any confusion.

There was enough happening to hold my attention, and the errors were sparce. By the time I reached the end, I forgot about the typos...

Luke, my comments on your grammar, etc were not to pick on you specifically. I'm sorry if you feel that way.

Great start to an intriguing plot here. Interesting protagonist with a suspenseful cliffhanger ending. Gave you a 4.5.

Very well written; it had suspense and substance to really continue a story with: 4/5.

I was not confused as to the gender of the main character. Yeah, the Friday thing threw me just a little, but not enough to warrant mentioning. In fact, if those are the only errors anyone can point out, then that is good, as I have seen much worse in books that have actually been published. I think the main point is that you told a story that makes people want to read more...so BRAVO and good job!

As a possible fix for the gender, ...grown accustomed to my early morning appearances. I saluted a finger to my forehead, offered, "Mornin' Pete." Something that clarifies who's speaking. I thought the janitor said it before the lead responded "Morning, Ms. B." It's not huge, but I stumbled too.

What I admire most is the creepiness. Sure, Ms. B (Rachel?) works for the feds to uncover corruption. At the same time, I felt moments where I wondered if "To Catch a Predator" was coming to her house. Teachers inviting students to come alone? Icky. Provided an unexpected and heavy twist. Also added dimension to the death threat; has she committed some crime herself? (Reread: "the powder I kept on hand for my students." and "I filled Jake's cup, choosing to wait until it whistled to fill mine.") Yuck.

I like the angles left open and Rachel's haunting history. Great opener. (4.5)

Excellent lead Shadinahnahnah! It makes me want a lot more - I really want to know what her job is, why she needs to escape and why the kid thinks she's a goner. Creepy yet sweet in a creepy sweet kinda way :-) 4.75 but a 4.5 on here.

I liked it, but i was also disturbed by her inviting kids to her house by themselves. Even if her motives are pure, but maybe that's why she's gonna die. hmm interesting.

this was very well written...kudos on the story...if it wins stage one, I look forward to writing a second chapter on it!

Well written, Shadina. I had the same pause on gender at the beginning, but easily figured it out once I hit the words "His weathered cheeks..." Your formatting also makes it clear. I wouldn't change it at all.
I was a little thrown by a couple of weird things that seemed inconsistent. She starts off talking about "our sleepy little town" but we quickly find out she's only lived there a year, and then she muses over "my own small town" so she still considers this one to be just another town and not her own. Why does she come to school two hours before classes? Also, do schools have "night janitors" that literally clean all night?
Pete's mock banter comes across as more creepy and less playful. I also got the weird vibe from her having all these children over at her home, alone, but maybe that's a small town thing.
All in all, a well-written chapter chock full of goodies that would be fun to mash on. Good luck.

OOH! I can answer that one! Well, part of it - It isn't abnormal for teachers to come in as much as two hours before school starts if they have a lot to prepare for the day (I worked in an elementary school for two years). As for the janitor, well, the place I worked had janitors that came in long before anyone else got there, and left long after everyone else was gone, so it isn't too far off to say that some schools might have a janitor come in overnight to do the general cleaning stuff. Trust me, schools get MESSY.

Thanks darlin' cause that one left me hanging. I really don't know the inner workings of schools, and was cringing to realize it showed! lol.

Great writing - sucked me right in! Looking forward to the next chapter

I couldn't wait, lol....I already did a second chapter!

How does it feel to have the number one story??

You should check out "Rainy Days and Mondays..." if you want an awesome story - I think Nashvillebecker probably has someone voting him down out of spite, 'cause it should be #1.

yes, its good!!

Thanks for all the great feedback! in answer to some questions/comments -
Nash- That is so funny about the creepiness angle - totally unintentional, but glad it came into play. Ironically, I come from a small town, and if a little one was sitting in the park alone in the cold, I would likely invite them over to warm up. I think it might be one of the small town things... The village raising the child mentality. So, that's where I was going with that. The fact that she invited another child over though could make for an interesting twist. Gotta love many minds mulling over the same piece!
The cocoa was also intended to be innocent - as will be cleared in the second chapter. Again, modeled after real life, where I give my kids swiss miss, and make my cocoa from scratch... But love how the twist could be applied! (or maybe not - yuck! lol)
Wolf - Oy - ya got me. I was trying to convey that she was starting to feel an attachment to the town, but I can see where it would be confusing. And her "own small town" was a place lived in the past... I don't know if there are any other gypsies out there, but I tend to feel that all the communities I've lived in are "mine". :)
As for coming to school early - well, I initially was going to describe more of her home, and show that she preferred to stick to the school as much as she could. But I didn't. Good idea for the revise, if I ever do it! :P And as for the janitor - uh, I really don't know! I just wanted a character for her to interact with, and glad my dear darling sister got me off the hook on that one! lol As for the banter, I was modeling that off this delivery driver I used to work with who was in his 60's, but still a shameless flirt. Oh well. I suppose it's the season for creepy, so I'll go with it! :)
Wendy - Great second chapter! I'll do a comment tomarrow, as it's pushing midnight, and I have to get up in four hours... And as cool as it looks to have the "number one story," it's only up there because more people have read it than the other ones posted. Once people read and vote on the other stories, mine could go anywhere! But I'm sure I'd be pretty psyched, if only I didn't have this tendancy to analyze everything.
And sorry about typos - it's been one of those days... :P

A few minor grammatical and punctuation errors. I stopped to re-read them just to make sure I was getting the correct context of your writing.

Here are my suggestions....cut the first few paragraphs and start with the whold FBI info spread, THEN, move into the walk to school. The first few paragraphs did not pull me in immediately and I found myself wanting to leave the story until I got to the FBI point. It's not that the writing wasn't good...I just fet it was in the wrong place. Whn I pick up a story, I want it to grab me and pull me in...lock me into reading.

My main hang-up is the fact that you kept repeating the fact that she had been in this town longer than any other.... yet, she never noticed anything going on with the kiddies. You give her a sharp, quick mind in the cemetary scene and I think it would have played better if that sense of keeness carried over into her daily life....she was around the kids all day, every day, inviting them into her home on occassion, yet managed to let their actions slip right past her.

I think your intention was to make us believe that the kids were hiding a secret so well that not even she could pick out the problem, thus lending an air of suspense. However, this actually played down the suspense for me....I saw it coming early on with the sick child and her mother...I knew something was going on with the kids....something more than a little avoidance of communication....because ahe's an FBI agent posing as a teacher for a reason, right? It had to be the kids!

So, instead of a big bang-up, twisted plot ending, I found myself reading what I expected to read. The twist would have been better if you hadn't led us up to it. Maybe the sick girl's mom wasn't so iffy....maybe the teacher's instincts were those of a concerned mother...after all, she had lost a child herself....there were a few ways you could have totally suprised us.

You write well and have tons of potential! For this story, though, I have to give you a 3.0 because I did not feel immediately vested in/connected to the character and I caught on too the plot too early, making the ending not so suprising.

Yes, there were a few errors, but this judging is on the story and if you would be able to mash it, so for that I give you a 4.

Persephonie gives you a lower one because you are ahead of her. No worries!

Hey, Living in LaLa Land.....

Quit bashing me!

First of all, I AM NOT POSTING A CHAPTER FOR THIS CONTEST!!!!

If you had at least read the title of my story, you would see that it is for the HAC Collaberation, NOT this contest.

2nd, if you had been a judge in the last contest, you would know that there were certain critera used in the judging process. Our scores were not merely based on whether we liked a story or it was mashable.

3rd, ANY writer who wishes to succeed needs to know where the errors are and what readers like to read about...waht makes it work for them as an individual....I pointed out both aspects in my comments.

Instead of bashing, rate my comment up or down. And try some constructive commentsthat might actually help a writer reach their goals.

Constructive comments? OK...

EVERYONE, WRITE YOUR STORIES IN 1ST PERSON POV ONLY.

MAKE SURE YOU CHECK OUT A BOOK FROM THE LIBRARY ON HOW TO WRITE A BOOK AND FOLLOW THE FORMULA EXACTLY.

That what you meant?

(sorry lala, didn't mean to jump in, but she has me a tad frustrated)

Wendy, you might want to dial it down a bit. Persephonie came out and commented voluntarily to offer help. If you don't agree with her criticisms, then ignore them, don't attack her. As far as her voting is concerned, she's entitled to vote as she feels, and at least she has the decency to explain her votes in her comments. Anyway, you are fortunate to have plenty of high votes on your two top-ten stories, so her votes do not have that great an impact on your scores. But attacking her critique? That's going to have an impact on your reputation here, and you may want to think about whether it's really worth doing.

Note to LalaLyric - registering a name simply to criticize Persephonie's comments? If you want to contribute by writing constructive comments on stories, or writing some stories of your own, then welcome.

Yes, you are right, Wolfram. I don't know what got into me. I don't mind critisism, but for some reason I was taking her personally. I actually thought she was picking on me. I think Lala got me going. The bad thing is, I think Lala is probably one of my friends. I had invited some of my myspace friends to come read mine and vote for me, and suddenly I find someone coming in and defending all my stuff.

Lala - if you came here for me, please don't feel you need to bash people for my benefit. If you aren't someone I know, then maybe you shoudl save your critiques until you have actually written something - that is only fair.

Persephonie, I am sorry. Some of things you pointed out are indeed right, some are opinions that you are entitled to, and some are not correct - but different teachers teach different ways, and you were prehaps taught in a different way than myself and some others. I do not agree with your scoring methods, but I will not harp on that any more. One suggestion, however...please take into consideration that some people enjoy writing in different POVs and should not be critiques for that. Again, I am sorry I got so upset (really NOT like me), and I hope you can accept my apology. Lastly, your story was indeed good and I enjoyed it.

By the way, you may not have posted this for this contest, but you did say if you win anyway that is good, right?

Of course, the competitive nature in me would love to win, and yes, I did write this specifically for the contest. But as my mind got on the idea, I now have another chapter or two in the works... I think I was just saying that I know I'm not the best writer on the site, so find it very likely that someone else will be #1. And that's cool. It's a fun learning experience, though I'm not too sure about all the bashing going on the past few days. :S (granted, I just started writing last month as a way to unwind, so not taking it seriously as others!)

Shadinah:

You said "Of course, the competitive nature in me would love to win, and yes, I did write this specifically for the contest."

I think you were responding to my immature remark to Persephonie...that was to her (though was wrong for to say to her).

And I am sorry to cram up your comment page with all my stupidity. Did not mean to get into that!

No apologies neccessary....seriously! :) We are all doing our best and it's hard to hear that someone doesn't love yur piece....we all take the good with the bad.

As for my HAC piece, I guess it was a bad idea to post it during the week of this contest....I had no intentions whatsoever of entering it....it's not my best work...I give myself a "c". Yeah, I said that thing about winning, but it was only because I was so shocked to see my bit in the top ten and figured, what the hell? But honestly, I'm not in it and don't wanna win it. Other people need a chance to shine!!!! I won the last one on a fluke...it was my first contest and I had only taken up writing in May when I joined this site....it had been over 20 years since I'd written anything. It was nice, but it's not my sole reason for being here, ya know?

If you want a truley unbiased opinion, print your piece and take it to an English instructor...tell them it's someone else's piece and they asked your opinion and you'd like a second look at it. Tell them it's for the first chapter of a short story. See what they tell you. I may have to eat my words, but I'm not a proud person and would be more than happy to hear what they have to say!

Good luck! Looks like this may be the winning piece! and in the end, it's up to the fellow mashers.....and that's the way it should be!

I would NEVER EVER pick on you or anyone intentionally. Sorry if I made you upset. I was not picking on you...promise! :)

Thank you for being accepting my apology (or rather telling me it wasn't needed). I was wrong though, but I am glad we can squash this. I am new to the site, and hope to run into you again!

Lisa (Lala) - I think that was for me. You didn't even apologize to her yet! (If you did, sorry, I can't find it)! Are you going to stay and mash the winner though?

Persephone - thanks, I appreciate a second chance!

I thought you told her from my email Sorry!

I am sorry P!

dunno....depends which one wins. I can write, but not that good. I want to write on your amanda one though. but you won't like it!!

There is a lot going on here! The FBI angle may be a little far fetched in the real world, but within the scope of the story, I think it fits very well. Your teacher seems to have a checkered past so I can totally believe the FBI blackmailing her into working for them. I gather that it wasn’t intentional, but wow do I love how creepy she is with the kids. It’s a great angle and adds to the mystery of her work with the Bureau. It seems like all the nit picks have been picked out so I’ll leave them be and just say overall you did a great job:)

Wow, I love your rip into LaLaLyric, it was entertaining to say the least. I'm not much of suspence reader, but good work! I actually read it when normally I wouldn't have bothered with the genre. Keep writting!

Dwayne, honey... Not that I mind you giving my sister a boost, as her chapter is very impressive and I do hope she wins (if mine doesn't, of course - ha!)... It's just that I can tell you've got some real issues going on, and this contest isn't supposed to be an outlet for some personal vendetta against other mashers. If you have an issue with someone, have a sit-down with them in the forum or something. The idea of this contest is for people to read the entries and give honest ratings based on what they believe the chapter deserves. Personal biases really shouldn't be coming into this.

DH...I am not in the contest. Didn't want to be.

Great story. I read it days ago and wanted to come back and comment. Good luck to you.

As far as everyone bashing Nash and Perse, grow up. You could not ask for two better people to critique your work. I consider them both friends. If you do not like what they post, go somewhere else.

Why is everyone so threatened by Persphonie? She is a good writter and a obviously honest person. I also think there is a reason Shadinah has the highest score, this story is the best I have read. People need to stop forming 'clicks' against other writters and just post what you honestly feel. Rate how you see fit; not what the general population is trending towards. Yes this story had FEW errors, but every writter makes those mistakes. That's why there are proof editors in this world. Great story Shadinah, wonderful imagination.....

Holy Boogers! I'm gone for a few days, and come back to a comment war! So, is this normal for contests, or is everyone extra touchy this time around? Wow!
I had planned to post a comment in response to Persephonie's critique a few days ago, and perhaps if I had others would not have felt the need to step in.
I really appreciated what she had to say! I can take a hard critique - I know I have a lot to learn, and I felt the points she brought up were fair and valid. Persephonie is an amazing writer, so it's logical that she judges a little harder than most. But she uses the same method for judging all the stories she reads, from what I've observed.
I think that there are several types of writers on this site, from really awesome, to fair, to not so good. So if a decent writer submits something, a mediocre writer would see it as a great piece and score it high, while an excellent writer would see the flaws and rate it lower. Both ratings would be fair, and the opinions would be valid - it's all based on the person's point of view. And the writer who's piece is in question should appreciate comments from both. I just can't see the logic in accepting praise for a good piece, and then getting offended at a critique from a more skilled writer. This is all a learning process! I know I am not the best writer here, so greatly appreciate all the tips from writers like Persephonie. The chapters I have read from her are exquisite, and I am grateful to learn how I can improve.
Now, this is all in response to her comment on mine - looking at her comments on others, I do agree that she's a little harder on third person POV. But she is very clear in how she judges, and explains her reasoning, which I do appreciate. There are other people on this site rating stories down and giving no reason for it. Maybe someone in that group has a thing against first person POV - who knows! It's all based on opinion - and to those who are trying to rig the ratings - shame on you! Don't rate someone's story down because you have a grudge - that's not the point of this site!
My final reminder is that judging is based on the opinions of a certain set of judges, so all this baloney about rating my chapter up and others down is not going to do any good anyway! The best story among the finalists will win based on the judges scores - not the ratings of the peers on the site.
I suppose I should thank all the people who have brought the comment war to my piece, because I earned 30 cents from all the activity in just three days! So thanks! And I'm looking forward to some semblance of peace on this site again!

"I suppose I should thank all the people who have brought the comment war to my piece, because I earned 30 cents from all the activity in just three days!"

What does that mean? You earn money from people reading your story?

And does anyone know what time they make decisions?

Nevermond about the 30c thing - I found where I have also earned....didn't know about that!

I loved this story and would thoroughly enjoy reading a finished book on it. It left me curious and wanting to read more. Hurry up and finish it so I can find out what's going on!! :o) Great job!

I forgot to add, I give it 5 stars!

Good dialogue--it feels natural, which can be difficult to master (it's something I struggle with in my own writing).

"Because through the children's minds, I could learn the secrets that the town tried to hide"--this hooked my interest. I'm committed to the story now.

I love the scene where our narrator drops the bomb that she's in a sort of witness protection program or running from the FEDS.

The ending was incredible, and perfect for mashing. Jake's dialogue to Ms. B is sooo creepy!!

Great job.

I'll be the first to offer congratulations. Well done.

Congratulations, Shadinah!

Awesome, Shadinah! Great job, and congrats!!

Yay! Congrats :)

Thanks so much, everybody!!! I can't wait to see where this thing goes! :)

Congratz Lady!! Nice job:)

Congradulations Shadinah! I only hope to one day be in your shoes! But since no one seems to get my peanut butter humor, doubt it's ever going to happen... oh well. ;)

congrats on your win!

Just read the news....congrats!

Congratulations, Shadinah! Well deserved.

Thanks shadinah, this is an excellent intro and leaves lots of room for subsequent authors. I only hope I can find the time to try a follow up somewhere in this storyline.

wow that's an amazing chapter! I definitely didn't see that one coming!

I was caught like a fish from beginning to end. I am curious now. Props on the chapter.

Incredibly well written. The ambiguity leaves a lot of questions which I'm sure will be answered later on. A nice cliffhanger at the end wanted me to read more.

Great Job.

Your Mistress.